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[1550] Raging noises

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[1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:22 am

Fred has posted the comic to his Patreon. He'll post it to the main site and elsewhere probably tomorrow.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:22 am

[Angry Junko Noises]
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Invisigoth » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:32 am

I feel a twinge of sadness for Junko

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Sat Mar 09, 2019 12:49 pm

Invisigoth wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:32 am
I feel a twinge of sadness for Junko
Oh yes. DrGero was exactly what she was looking for in a boyfriend / replacement-father-figure: "a gentleman ... intelligent, mature, older" [1508]. Sure he was paying her for dates, but he was doing that because he liked her, and Junko is cynical and naïve enough to look past that. Or so it all seemed.

But now she's going to find out what he's really like, why he's really paying her for dates, and most importantly what he really thinks of her. Ashe is going to set her straight. Poor Junko.

Edit to add:
Still a question whether Junko will believe Ashe or not though. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, and Junko doesn't know Ashe yet.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Roamer » Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:01 pm

paarfi wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 12:49 pm
Invisigoth wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:32 am
I feel a twinge of sadness for Junko
Oh yes. DrGero was exactly what she was looking for in a boyfriend / replacement-father-figure: "a gentleman ... intelligent, mature, older" [1508]. Sure he was paying her for dates, but he was doing that because he liked her, and Junko is cynical and naïve enough to look past that. Or so it all seemed.

But now she's going to find out what he's really like, why he's really paying her for dates, and most importantly what he really thinks of her. Ashe is going to set her straight. Poor Junko.

Edit to add:
Still a question whether Junko will believe Ashe or not though. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt, and Junko doesn't know Ashe yet.
Junko: "I'm leaving!"
Ashe: "Nope."

lolz.

I feel more than a twinge of sadness for Junko, but it's always better to know the truth, even when it hurts.

It's possible that Junko won't believe Ashe, but she'll ask the good doctor. Who will either admit the truth, or lie and be used as a punching bag by Ashe. I honestly don't think he'll lie to her, though...he thinks he's doing a good thing, and he'll want to justify himself to her. Good luck with that.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Rapierman » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:41 am

Hard to tell with all that blurry text. :/
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Invisigoth » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:44 am

Rapierman wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:41 am
Hard to tell with all that blurry text. :/
That's what she* said!

*Ashe

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by infidel » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:01 pm

Look at that tail. Must take a picture. For SCIENCE!
paarfi wrote: wrote:But now she's going to find out what he's really like, why he's really paying her for dates, and most importantly what he really thinks of her. Ashe is going to set her straight. Poor Junko.
I dunno. Everyone has some unpleasant aspects to their personality. He looked past hers...
Roamer wrote: wrote:Junko: "I'm leaving!"
Ashe: "Gotta catch'em all"
Last edited by infidel on Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:05 pm

Rapierman wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:41 am
Hard to tell with all that blurry text. :/
Just to be clear about this. Junko's words are blurred because Ashe is deaf. Ashe can see Megumi and Ping's lips move, so she knows what they said. But she's looking at the back of Junko's head.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by infidel » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:09 pm

paarfi wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:05 pm
Rapierman wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:41 am
Hard to tell with all that blurry text. :/
Just to be clear about this. Junko's words are blurred because Ashe is deaf. Ashe can see Megumi and Ping's lips move, so she knows what they said. But she's looking at the back of Junko's head.
Thank you. I wasn't getting the blurry text either. That makes perfect sense.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by cidjen » Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:08 pm

I look at the blurry text and I can't help imagining that as sort of a Rob Bryden's 'tiny man in a box' kinda voice ...

Jokes aside,
I have a feeling that what I had earlier in the summary, as the Dr Engineer, he would be Junior's uncle, no "apostrophes". But that is just me...

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Lingman » Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:30 pm

I have a REALLY bad feeling about what actually happened in panel 3. Was he recording the discussion he had with Ashe? Or just taking a picture of her on the way across the street?

I suspect that either he's got his next few data points for the Foxgirl edition of the EDS...

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:03 pm

Lingman wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:30 pm
I have a REALLY bad feeling about what actually happened in panel 3. Was he recording the discussion he had with Ashe? Or just taking a picture of her on the way across the street?
I suspect that either he's got his next few data points for the Foxgirl edition of the EDS...
It's a good point. DrGero has grim look on his face in panel 3. I wonder if Ashe is going to get a visit from our favorite Sony Enforcement Division operative.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Liminaut » Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:26 pm

paarfi wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 5:03 pm
Lingman wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 4:30 pm
I have a REALLY bad feeling about what actually happened in panel 3. Was he recording the discussion he had with Ashe? Or just taking a picture of her on the way across the street?
I suspect that either he's got his next few data points for the Foxgirl edition of the EDS...
It's a good point. DrGero has grim look on his face in panel 3. I wonder if Ashe is going to get a visit from our favorite Sony Enforcement Division operative.
Not so much grim as focused. I think DrGero is in data collection mode -- so Sony can get some of the parts more realistic.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by cidjen » Sun Mar 10, 2019 8:07 pm

So,
name it a shower thought, but here is a little of Ping's perspective... from what I perceive.

It all started when Tsubasa left her with Largo and Piro. She was probably back then all as programmed in the lab.
She became dependant on Piro even if he wasn't paying attention to her.

Then Ping started going about with Miho, and got a bit of her personality prevailing.

Ping also had a rub with Kimiko (as she was walking with her to Megagamers, at the coming-to-end time of chapter 8). This one was short-lived, but was quite important for Ping, emotionally. Because technically, Ping was still dependant on Miho then.

Then Ping got upset by Miho's disapperarance and Junko dragged her off that dependency. Ping became dependent on Junko then.

Getting to know Junko, not just the fact of the reaction of purging Miho, triggered the funny reaction in Ping's drivers, as if it's been recognized, that she's got close to one of the sources used originally for Ping's personality.

Now that Junko got this cross with Ping, I sense good deal of weeping coming, and wonder, who will Ping become dependant on this time... I'd say Ashe but hmm... not sure if Ashe would actually want that for herself? Not enough data about Ashe, I guess.

I'm deliberately ignoring some timeline here, like, when Ping changes the person she's dependant on, it (almost always) ends up in a lot of weeping (the emotional purge). I guess, if Ping starts to cry after Junko got cross with her, it's hard to ignore a girl weeping like Ping can (screw it Sony, why did you not program something else to happen upon the emotional purge, but weeping?)

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by BetaCygnus » Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:37 am

@cidjen: it doesn’t look to me as if Junko wanted Ping to become dependant upon her either. Wanting it or not doesn’t seem to influence Ping’s autoprogramming…

@general:

Okay, this was a very… quiet scene. I somehow interpreted the blurred text as a graphical expression of Ashe’s deafness straight away — and I’m guessing they have a nice side effect in blurring out some very quiestionable wording from Junko in the process.

I’m still having a hard time being negative about Dr Engineer. I agree with the more neutral responses concerning him in the above discussion. And I’m guessing some of those who are portraying him as a bad person would not mind seeing Ping growing fox ears and a tail to match the pair. Just don’t forget to thank Dr "Bad Guy" for giving her the ability to do so. =)

I do feel for Junko, too, though. But also for Ping. It’s a complicated situation and I find it really hard to determine who’s right and who’s wrong — I have the same problem in real life. I tend to want everybody to have good intentions. It just doesn’t turn out that way as often as I would want to.

But Ashe may be wrong as well in stopping Junko from storming out the door trying to find the Doctor. Why is she automatically the one who is in the right? Because she is a girl? Because she can twitch her ears and her tail? Because she is deaf? Because she has a well-known crash cymbal brand logo on her shirt? Does that make her perspective the one to be the judge and jury?

And what gives her the right to interfere with Junko? She doesn’t even know what she said to Ping…

Does she want to keep her from the Doctor? If so — should she, really?

Questions, questions, questions…

Well done, Fred.
Thank you for the update! =)
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by Teddy-Werebear » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:16 am

Looks like we are getting the perspective of Ashe, but the last couple of panels she can see Junko's lips. So I do not understand why her dialogue is obscured.
Good job Dr. Feelgood... document away. No sense wasting the chance at a foxgirl cosplayer enthusiast walking away. Film that butt shot for the glory of research and production model improvement. What a creeper.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by cidjen » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:21 am

BetaCygnus wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:37 am
@cidjen: it doesn’t look to me as if Junko wanted Ping to become dependant upon her either. Wanting it or not doesn’t seem to influence Ping’s autoprogramming…
No MT character really ever acknowledged Ping as 'dependant' on them (maybe apart from Piro, who felt responsible for her not getting lost for Tsubasa). This did not stop Ping from becoming (at the very least, emotionally) dependant on them, right ? Whether it was acknowledged (like Piro) or not (like Miho, Kimi or Junko).
Uhh... Piro, or any of the boys, who instantly recognized Ping as a robot, weren't really able to give her the emotional feed she wanted...
Miho at first put up a front but then *forgot* and got photographed (including *pantsutagging*) in the vulnerable state...
Kimiko might have known Ping is a robot, but still was talking to her as to a real person, less like to a robot, more like to a child ("discard the feelings tou think you want to have, find the feelings you really care about")
Junko went from mobbing and berating Ping for "inappropriate" behavior for a high school girl, to being saved with a 'tricity pole, to advising Ping to post footage of Miho to social networks, to becoming emotional support when 'Miho' finally escaped.

@general:


But Ashe may be wrong as well in stopping Junko from storming out the door trying to find the Doctor. Why is she automatically the one who is in the right? Because she is a girl? Because she can twitch her ears and her tail? Because she is deaf? Because she has a well-known crash cymbal brand logo on her shirt? Does that make her perspective the one to be the judge and jury?

And what gives her the right to interfere with Junko? She doesn’t even know what she said to Ping…

Does she want to keep her from the Doctor? If so — should she, really?
Ashe had just berated Dr Engineer for treating girls like a bag of parts.

Junko is hot-headed, but it's Ashe who knows what Dr said, Junko does not, and she also doesn't know what was Dr's purpose for meeting her.

Ashe's influence can either make Junko think of some cold plan of revenge, if she does cool down, or go completely postal on him right there and now. Depends on what Ashe wants, I guess, we don't know much about that yet.


Questions, questions, questions…

Well done, Fred.
Thank you for the update! =)
Ditto, nice page Fred :)

EDIT
Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:16 am
Looks like we are getting the perspective of Ashe, but the last couple of panels she can see Junko's lips. So I do not understand why her dialogue is obscured.
Last couple of panels, Junko is looking still AWAY from Ashe, even as she walks towards her. Makes it easier for Ashe to catch her.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by BetaCygnus » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:00 am

cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:21 am
No MT character really ever acknowledged Ping as 'dependant' on them (maybe apart from Piro, who felt responsible for her not getting lost for Tsubasa). This did not stop Ping from becoming (at the very least, emotionally) dependant on them, right ? Whether it was acknowledged (like Piro) or not (like Miho, Kimi or Junko).
Exactly my point. =)
cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:21 am
Ashe had just berated Dr Engineer for treating girls like a bag of parts.
…as in ‘a bag of *body* parts’, or ‘a fascinating combination of intriguing personality treats’?

So far, it seems to me that the Doctor focuses on the latter while being aware of the ‘nice’ in a nice looking girl.
I still do not consider that to be creepy.

He’s not showing any creepiness like the guys at Anna Miller’s, discussing the details of Kimiko’s breasts {0844}.
Those are people who only look at a girl to see (or imagine, or study) her body parts — for lust.
Now *that* is creepy in *my* dictionary.

=/
cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:21 am
Ashe's influence can either make Junko think of some cold plan of revenge, if she does cool down, or go completely postal on him right there and now. Depends on what Ashe wants, I guess, we don't know much about that yet.
…but noone out here on the Forums is calling Ashe a bad girl for interfering.
What gives her the right to interfere? What gives her the right to have anything to *want* in the given situation?

She may think she’s doing the right thing — while she might do better to stay out of a situation between others.
I’m only popping the option that it might not be Ashe’s business.

=)
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by cidjen » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:02 am

BetaCygnus wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:00 am
cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:21 am
Ashe's influence can either make Junko think of some cold plan of revenge, if she does cool down, or go completely postal on him right there and now. Depends on what Ashe wants, I guess, we don't know much about that yet.
…but noone out here on the Forums is calling Ashe a bad girl for interfering.
What gives her the right to interfere? What gives her the right to have anything to *want* in the given situation?

She may think she’s doing the right thing — while she might do better to stay out of a situation between others.
I’m only popping the option that it might not be Ashe’s business.

=)
So it's prime material for speculation here, again :)

Based on what we know, Ashe's cross with The Doctor Engineer, who treated Junko's (elements of) personality as (one of) the elements programmed into Ping. Ashe just had shown angry kitsune face to him and pushed him into his chair, to prevent him from going after or even calling out to Junko. Also Ashe went to talk to The Doctor Engineer, after 'hearing' from Ping, what Ping thought her purpose for this 'date' was.

On the other hand, Junko is cross with Ping for interfering with her 'date' (or meeting with her uncle? (no quotes, look, this might be important?)) and is going to head out out of The Foxhole. Ashe suddenly intercepts Junko mid-flight.

I suppose, first thing Ashe would ask is 'where are you going?' :) or 'what are you going to do?' :)

Now looking at what what Ashe would LIKE to happen...

Maybe she sees Junko as the victim of abuse (of whatever kind, since ?) and worries about continuation thereof. And would want the abuser to be punished, by his victim. Or brought to justice? Maybe she herself knows somehow something about this kind of abuse, and wants to make sure it is stopped.

Would Ashe take time to listen to Junko's side of the story first? Or act on whatever assumptions Ashe might be having? Probably depends on how much time will they have to interact.

It could be also, that Ashe just looks into Junko's eyes, says nothing, then moves out of the way. But the shock of that encounter would be enough to shake Junko's initial intention, whatever that may be.

Let's also not forget, that Megumi and Grandma (and Ping) are watching and listening to what may be about to happen.

(side note, I don't think our 'favorite' SED operative would show up since the 'schooling' on sex wasn't done online and Ping does not have her wireless earpiece any more; though if he did, it would be just a matter of Dr Engineer calling the higherups to call him off, so his presence could be beneficial here if it happened.)

Another thought - remembering how Junko's father despised 'the likes of' Ping back in chapter 10 - i am sorta not long after translating that recently - he recognized Ping as the prototype EDS immediately. Now thinking about it, it could be sort of sibling rivalry (where Dr Engineer is the older of the siblings, or at least equal age from a different branch of the family, like a cousin... as in, neither Sony nor Nintendo would be happy to have two brothers this high up in their hierarchy working in their direct competitors ranks... but this is a mere digression)

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by garrulousNPC » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:33 am

I see a lot of discussion about Ping, but look at it from Junko's perspective. Her friend has just tried to usurp her relationship with someone she cares a great deal about. This is how a lifetime 'hate relationship' is formed. Guys might not get it, but many girls will.

I still remember hearing my niece tell my nephew's wife "YOU ARE DEAD TO ME." at the end of a bitter fight. This was after the two of them had been good friends and running around together for a dozen years. Especially between teenage girls, this happens. This could very well have been what Junko said to Ping.

PS: This is my third account in the forum. I think someone needs to do a better job of maintaining it for us lurkers.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by paarfi » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:05 am

garrulousNPC wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:33 am
PS: This is my third account in the forum. I think someone needs to do a better job of maintaining it for us lurkers.
Sorry about that. We weeded a lot of dead accounts out when we went to the new forum site, but some still-active-lurkers got caught in that too. Hopefully that won't happen again.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by BetaCygnus » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:07 am

cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:02 am
So it's prime material for speculation here, again :)
Be my guest. Glad you’re finding my mere reflections to be so facilitating.

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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by darrin » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:51 am

Ha ha, awesome. I called Ashe "Teal'c" at one point in a twitch chat. That half-a-clothesline (? what do you call it when you hook the arm instead of the neck?) is totally a Teal'c move. :lol:
BetaCygnus wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:37 am
I tend to want everybody to have good intentions.
Despite that being exactly the sentiment exploited by the "bad guys" -- all the way up to con artists who exploit it deliberately and actively -- it's still hard to denigrate such a sentiment; when you're dealing with the 90% (or whatever) of people who aren't "bad guys", it's precisely what makes communication between strangers possible. Add into the mix that the Old Man (I think I said this a thread or two back) almost certainly thinks of himself as having good intentions, and doing good work... it's a safe bet Fred is deliberately steering things in very complicated directions.
And what gives her the right to interfere with Junko? She doesn’t even know what she said to Ping…
It might help not to think of it so much as "interference" as opposed to a much more... temporary restraint. As Professor Quirrell would put it, "There is a true fact, known to me but not to you, of which I would like to convince you, Ms. Ibara." Once Ashe conveys these facts, if Junko still wants to leave, I'm sure Ashe isn't going to stop her.
Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:16 am
Looks like we are getting the perspective of Ashe, but the last couple of panels she can see Junko's lips. So I do not understand why her dialogue is obscured.
Look at the angles again. Panel 8 is directly from Ashe's pov. She is looking straight at Ping, Megumi is next to Ping but facing forward enough that her mouth is clearly visible. Junko on the other hand has her back to Ashe. In panel 9, Junko's body is almost directly oriented toward Ashe, but Junko is looking back, away from Ashe, and her hair is covering almost all of whatever would be otherwise visible (to Ashe) of Junko's jawline.
Film that butt shot for the glory of research and production model improvement. What a creeper.
No but look at his face, and think about what paarfi said above about his "grim look". Unless one has a really low opinion of Fred's ability to convey "subtle language" in faces... that is very clearly NOT "oh yeah shake it baby", but rather "time to make the donuts". Same shit different day, just another part of the job.

I continue to predict that the "creeper" crowd will end up longing for the day when he used to be merely a "creepy pedophile" and not the existential horror Fred will craft him into.
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Re: [1550] Raging noises

Post by cidjen » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:23 pm

BetaCygnus wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:07 am
cidjen wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:02 am
So it's prime material for speculation here, again :)
Be my guest. Glad you’re finding my mere reflections to be so facilitating.

=)
Don't tempt me, 'cos I just imagined a scene where Junko continues to shout something in the area of 'If all you all wanted to tell her was about sex, why did you just not let her watch any of those rooms, she's a frickin machine!' - points at the screen just-about-showing Piro x Kimiko in their room - Ping follows Junko's finger, recognizes the couple, breaks down into crying (another emotional purge?) then Junko is like 'hey, what happened?' then her gaze follows her own finger and she says 'oh... isn't that... that idol?'...

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