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[1532] The battlefield before me

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cidjen
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by cidjen » Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:20 am

Rapierman wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:14 pm
Invisigoth wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:49 pm
He digitally collects girls
So, kiddie porn, eh? (I did hint at this.)
It's still, you know, SFS, and may still turn into a Fred Herring (I kinda-sorta still hope so).
Also what happened to 'do not suspect malice if something can be explained by just incompetence' hmm ? :)
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darrin
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by darrin » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:35 am

cidjen wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:20 am
Rapierman wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:14 pm
So, kiddie porn, eh? (I did hint at this.)
Also what happened to 'do not suspect malice if something can be explained by just incompetence' hmm ? :)
"Incompetent" isn't the only alternative to "creepy pervert".

Again, suppose (not asking anyone to believe this, just considering the range of possibilities that are still, er, possible :roll:) that this isn't an EK creep, but someone Junko is meeting because he has something to do with Ping, most likely something to do with Ping's development.

To design a realistic simulation of a teenage girl, you need a lot of information on the (social) behavior of actual teenage girls. Direct observation of said behavior could range from expensive to illegal depending on how such information (let alone the girls themselves :shock:) were "collected". Sony would prefer to keep both the research budget and legal risk down by collecting publicly available information, i.e. online profiles (e.g. facebook).

Not only would this not be illegal (let alone not (necessarily) perverted), it could be done in a completely legitimate above-board way. My own background leans more toward medical than (corporate) "social", but over there we had very strictly delineated levels of what was allowed under what circumstances: collecting identifiable medical information (eg X-rays or other images) required an IRB protocol, signed consent from the patient, and even then the images had to be completely "sanitized" (name, patient id numbers etc removed) before they even got to the researchers. At the other extreme, publicly available info (or "aggregate" info like survey responses) could be collected / handled without any IRB protocol at all (again provided the info either had no names etc. to begin with or the names etc were sanitized from the data).

So Sony would have a process (people separate from the designers / engineers, or even a robot that walks the facebook pages) that pulls profiles, "sanitizes" them (takes out names and other uniquely indentifiable info), and passes it on to the design team. The Old Man then ("digitally") collects these anonymized profiles of the girls in question and uses them to train the AI under development. Again, legitimately and above-board. :ugeek:

(Please note that even in the above model, I am not yet assuming he is a "good" guy, as a simplistic alternative to the obviously bad guy creepy pervert theory. It would remain to be seen whether he is on Ping's side (did he help her "escape"?), or is a smarter (and thus much more dangerous) version of Ed...)

EDIT:
@cidjen, somewhat off topic: Oh cool, I just figured out which strip your avatar is from. :D (I was thrown off for a while by "moj angelski", which I was thinking, "my angelic"? So maybe one of the conscience ones? But angelic is an adjective, where is the noun? And then I found the right one (searched on "creative") and was kicking myself for not recognizing the Russian cognate "angliiski". :lol: Anyway good job and good luck on that translation project. 8-)
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cidjen
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by cidjen » Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:18 pm

So, um, it's like motion capture for the models of movement, you think the Old Guy is capturing Emotive data for realistic emotion model? Yeah I'd buy that ;) not sure if I'd buy that /game/ but yeah.

@darrin: yeah, thanks, you know, I was actually thinking, when I get that far - when I reach the comic they were sourced from - do you mind, if I 'scanlated' your rescripts to Polish :) ? Hopefully my English would be creative enough to translate /that/ ;)
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BetaCygnus
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by BetaCygnus » Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:56 pm

Rapierman wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:14 pm
Invisigoth wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:49 pm
He digitally collects girls
So, kiddie porn, eh? (I did hint at this.)
I really don’t believe that. There are alternatives, you know.
Not every man’s thoughts revolve around porn while they are being appreciative of girls.

Just one example?
He might be someone who likes to collect *non-erotic* images of girls. :o
I know, it’s a revolutionary thought, but still… he might be. I hope he is anyway…

Just Google "girl portrait" on images.google.com — you might actually be surprised at the number of quite innocent images you’ll find. :idea:

Maybe he’s a photographer himself too; Junko may have posed for him — again, non-erotically — earlier on and enjoyed the positive experience of being treated with respect by a grown up man for a change. If I were a photographer, her expressiveness and the unruly hair would pique my interest in her as an interesting, real life, non-supermodel model. =)

darrin wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:37 pm
Invisigoth wrote:
Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:04 pm

Junko seems to actually LIKE this guy and was enthused to get ready for a meet up. I really don't think that she'd be so happy if it were some garden variety panty sniffer who wanted to bother her.
That is one of the key components of the argument I've been making for the past, wow literally ten strips now. So yeah, definitely same page with you there. 8-)
So am I. =)
darrin wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:35 am

(Please note that even in the above model, I am not yet assuming he is a "good" guy, as a simplistic alternative to the obviously bad guy creepy pervert theory. It would remain to be seen whether he is on Ping's side (did he help her "escape"?), or is a smarter (and thus much more dangerous) version of Ed...)
…I hope he’s on Ping’s side. I think that if he would be out to "retrieve" or just "catch" her, he wouldn’s be sitting there drinking his coffee so placidly.
He much rather wouldn’t have let her out of his sight, would he? :?:
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darrin
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by darrin » Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:36 pm

cidjen wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:18 pm
So, um, it's like motion capture for the models of movement, you think the Old Guy is capturing Emotive data for realistic emotion model? Yeah I'd buy that ;) not sure if I'd buy that /game/ but yeah.
That's a much better (more "MegaTokyo style") way of putting it than I had in mind. So, yes. :D
@darrin: yeah, thanks, you know, I was actually thinking, when I get that far - when I reach the comic they were sourced from - do you mind, if I 'scanlated' your rescripts to Polish :) ? Hopefully my English would be creative enough to translate /that/ ;)
Wow, flattering. :oops: I would say first that I don't think I ever did anything unique; I was inspired (shortly after joining the old forums) and influenced by many superior examples: Zahooee, baka_bomb, Captain Button, Brigid EDITand SarethEDIT to name a few (Negima was another giant that I had some interaction with but was mostly before my time infortunately). So if you are asking around and I would be one among many then definitely yes; if you meant me in particular I would say check out the archives before you decide that. :lol: I would ask that Fred's copyright be retained on any of mine you take (I always kept those to make it clear who the original "owner" was). PM me for further details or if I can assist in any way.
BetaCygnus wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:56 pm
I really don’t believe that. There are alternatives, you know.
<darrin is in love>
SpoilerShow
Oh come on, I meant digitally. Why does everyone go straight for the pervy interpretation. :lol: :lol:
…I hope he’s on Ping’s side. I think that if he would be out to "retrieve" or just "catch" her, he wouldn’s be sitting there drinking his coffee so placidly.
He much rather wouldn’t have let her out of his sight, would he? :?:
Agreed; I think I mentioned the calm cool coffee drinking a few posts back, but consider it mostly subjective, so I haven't been leaning on it too heavily. (In Bayesian terms it might be worth a few percentage points one way or other but is probably not by itself gonna be a determiner.) Gosh, considering this started so recently I am starting to think this might be one of my favorite sub-arcs yet. Fred is awesome. 8-)

I should have gotten this out before the new comic went up (which I have not yet seen, honest), but if anyone thinks I am just about the Bayesian and not capable of making a crazy prediction:

The Old Man knows sign language.
Last edited by darrin on Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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cidjen
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by cidjen » Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:02 pm

darrin wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:36 pm

Wow, flattering. :oops: I would say first that I don't think I ever did anything unique; I was inspired (shortly after joining the old forums) and influenced by many superior examples: Zahooee, baka_bomb, Captain Button, Brigid to name a few (Negima was another giant that I had some interaction with but was mostly before my time infortunately). So if you are asking around and I would be one among many then definitely yes; if you meant me in particular I would say check out the archives before you decide that. :lol: I would ask that Fred's copyright be retained on any of mine you take (I always kept those to make it clear who the original "owner" was). PM me for further details or if I can assist in any way.
I ask because I liked them, that is all :) especially the rescripted arc with magical girl capabilities -but I see them all hillarious :)

OFC I will retain whatever copyright stamp is there, I will not alter it in any other way than just the polish text on balloons. I might do them in slightly different font than you did but. Thanks I am looking forward to it :)
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darrin
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by darrin » Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:50 pm

cidjen wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:02 pm
-but I see them all hillarious :)
Meh, this one was way more brilliant than anything I ever did, just to pick one out of about a bajillion examples. (Sadly so many have become "user posted image" over the decade since I was involved in the scene...) Not withdrawing permission or anything, just making it clear I don't deserve singling out, not by a long shot. But this is way off topic by now so I would suggest PM or maybe starting up a thread in Fan Works for further discussion.
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cidjen
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by cidjen » Fri Aug 24, 2018 4:13 am

Ho, I'm sorry, it wasn't to single you out :) you were just the first person I asked permission from :) and it'll largely depend on how much time I actually have for it (scanlating with GIMP takes time... Megalettering is convenient after all...)
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by BetaCygnus » Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:58 am

darrin wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:36 pm
BetaCygnus wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:56 pm
I really don’t believe that. There are alternatives, you know.
<darrin is in love>
SpoilerShow
Oh come on, I meant digitally. Why does everyone go straight for the pervy interpretation. :lol: :lol:
:lol:
Agreed; I think I mentioned the calm cool coffee drinking a few posts back, …
Sorry, I hadn’t meant my observation to sound like an original argument. :oops:
Fred is awesome. 8-)
So true! =)
I should have gotten this out before the new comic went up (which I have not yet seen, honest), but if anyone thinks I am just about the Bayesian and not capable of making a crazy prediction:

The Old Man knows sign language.
Ooh. New post? Looking forward to it! And we’ll see about the sign language.
It would add interesting content to the speculations if he did know it.

;)
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darrin
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by darrin » Fri Aug 24, 2018 11:01 am

BetaCygnus wrote:
Fri Aug 24, 2018 7:58 am
darrin wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:36 pm
Agreed; I think I mentioned the calm cool coffee drinking a few posts back, …
Sorry, I hadn’t meant my observation to sound like an original argument. :oops:
Oh, sorry, didn't mean it that way... In fact I should I have said more explicitly that I now think I was undervaluing this observation; you're right that him having malevolent intentions toward Ping is hard to reconcile with his casual attitude (she's gone completely out of sight)...
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darrin
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by darrin » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:56 pm

cidjen wrote:
Thu Aug 23, 2018 4:18 pm
So, um, it's like motion capture for the models of movement, you think the Old Guy is capturing Emotive data for realistic emotion model? Yeah I'd buy that ;) not sure if I'd buy that /game/ but yeah.
Oh snap, I just got it; SEVS: Sony eMotion-captured Versatile Simulacrum.

(I almost went with "Simulant" but that sounded a little too Blade-Runnery :lol:)
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Re: [1532] The battlefield before me

Post by Yl33 D4 N00b » Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:26 pm

"Stimulant" could work, too..... ;)

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