[1568] making it up

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Invisigoth » Wed Feb 19, 2020 7:48 pm

Ashe is the deaf foxgirl, and yeah Yaku drools from having a good skritch :D

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by maldrul » Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:24 pm

Eraden wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:58 pm
Was Yaku drooling in the second last panel? If so, I wonder if that was from being scritched. Maybe fox girls like that sort of thing. I wouldn't want to see anyone try it on the deaf girl though. I suspect the person attempting it would lose an arm or two.
ALL kitsune love scritches. Just make sure you ask before you go up to a strange kit. :>
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by darrin » Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:29 pm

Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:57 am
Largo is being choked to death by Moerika... :(
Quitcher whining Largo and suck it up. OH WAIT YOU CAN"T HA HA HA HA
I do not trust the words of foul Miho. She is a deceiver.
Nonsense, she's habitually snarky but never deceived anybody.

Okay, according to Piro she was lying when she lied that she wasn't a girl. But -1 * -1 = 1 so that doesn't count.
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Roamer » Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:10 pm

darrin wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:29 pm
Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 12:57 am
Largo is being choked to death by Moerika... :(
Quitcher whining Largo and suck it up. OH WAIT YOU CAN"T HA HA HA HA
I do not trust the words of foul Miho. She is a deceiver.
Nonsense, she's habitually snarky but never deceived anybody.

Okay, according to Piro she was lying when she lied that she wasn't a girl. But -1 * -1 = 1 so that doesn't count.
I am positive that your words will be convincing enough to have Teddy rethink his position regarding Miho.
.....Nope, I can't even type that with a straight face.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Teddy-Werebear » Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:37 pm

darrin wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:29 pm
Nonsense, she's habitually snarky but never deceived anybody.

Okay, according to Piro she was lying when she lied that she wasn't a girl. But -1 * -1 = 1 so that doesn't count.
You are not being a very honest broker, D.
There are a great many examples of Miho's deceptiveness, misleading, trickery, etc. in there story writ large.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by jkhartl » Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:45 pm

Eraden wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:58 pm
Was Yaku drooling in the second last panel? If so, I wonder if that was from being scritched. Maybe fox girls like that sort of thing. I wouldn't want to see anyone try it on the deaf girl though. I suspect the person attempting it would lose an arm or two.
To be fair Largo is drooling in the 7th panel. Think it's for the same reason?
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Yl33 D4 N00b » Thu Feb 20, 2020 9:56 am

jkhartl wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 11:45 pm
Eraden wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 5:58 pm
Was Yaku drooling in the second last panel? If so, I wonder if that was from being scritched. Maybe fox girls like that sort of thing. I wouldn't want to see anyone try it on the deaf girl though. I suspect the person attempting it would lose an arm or two.
To be fair Largo is drooling in the 7th panel. Think it's for the same reason?
I think it's due to oxygen loss/ lack of blood flow to the brain..... :lol:

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by maldrul » Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:50 pm

Miho and Erika are holding their 'attack dogs' Yaku and Largo, respectively at bay while Erika interrogates Miho about Moeko.

The difference in their control styles is evident.
Miho placates Yaku with scritches while Erika yanks Largo's leash (choke hold).
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by darrin » Thu Feb 20, 2020 8:18 pm

Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 10:37 pm
There are a great many examples of Miho's deceptiveness, misleading, trickery, etc. in there story writ large.
Well don't leave me hanging there, name one.

EDIT:
maldrul wrote:
Thu Feb 20, 2020 7:50 pm
Miho placates Yaku with scritches while Erika yanks Largo's leash (choke hold).
Heh, nice. :D I am suddenly reminded of the tenth Doctor's line to Donna Noble at the end of a long-winded exposition of his: "and.... and you have never been so quiet." (Of course she had been snatched away not put in a choke hold, but Largo has certainly never been this quiet before. :lol:)
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by cidjen » Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:34 pm

Something came to my head.
And I could not shake it off.

I could not make it into song.

But it comes out as a question.

Given what Miho Said here, that she made her story whatever she wanted.
On a scale of 1 to 10.

How likely is it, you think, that what she told to Kimi in 1400 to 1407…

Was also made up...? A story she came up with?

( Not asking Teddy cause to him the number would be 1337 :) probably.)

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Peter » Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:51 am

cidjen wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:34 pm
How likely is it, you think, that what she told to Kimi in 1400 to 1407…

Was also made up...? A story she came up with?
It think it is very likely. For awhile now I have believed that Miho made that whole story up. At no time does she equate that story with her own life, nor does she actually claim that that was Kotone's backstory.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Teddy-Werebear » Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:48 am

cidjen wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:34 pm
Something came to my head.
And I could not shake it off.

I could not make it into song.

But it comes out as a question.

Given what Miho Said here, that she made her story whatever she wanted.
On a scale of 1 to 10.

How likely is it, you think, that what she told to Kimi in 1400 to 1407…

Was also made up...? A story she came up with?

( Not asking Teddy cause to him the number would be 1337 :) probably.)
She is a liar liar...
I wish that her pantsu would catch on fire!

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by cidjen » Mon Feb 24, 2020 8:16 am

Haha, count on Teddy to spread Miho-hate lol.

No, what I meant is like...

She had a miserable, repeating, looping existence. By now, nobody knows what really happened (and some think, it's not important) why she became that way.

So she herself came with ways to try explain it, even to herself. As explained in current page.

It's not a lie per-se, because nobody, even her herself, knows what the truth really was. So whatever explanation can be provided, if it fits, it has the criteria to BE the truth.

Her own take on her own story is the only explanation that exists. Anything else happening, is unprovable, even if this one could be doubted, we (and her) don't have anything else to believe in.

So in that case, any story that fits the framework, that doesn't have the bad ending, SHOULD be enough to break the dependency on the old one, right? Make it good enough that people will get to believe in it, and you're set for life (in both literal and usual meaning of that phrase).

If it was so easy for an inexperienced storyteller to play out the 'bad' end such that the Horde believed in it, it should be easy, for an experienced writer, to write it so that the bad ending is avoided. Right?

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Teddy-Werebear » Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:52 pm

Cidjen... that sounds like a version of Johnie Cochran's "Chewbaca Defense."

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by darrin » Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:16 pm

cidjen wrote:
Sun Feb 23, 2020 6:34 pm
How likely is it, you think, that what she told to Kimi in 1400 to 1407…
Cui bono? Why would Miho have to lie to Kimiko? What does she need from Kimiko that she needs to hide the truth from her?

If she's lying in that scene, where does the lie start and where does it end? Is she faking her distress at Piro's "death"? Lying that she considers herself responsible for that? Did she fake the heart attack? (They don't just install a pacemaker if you walk in and say you want one, they have tests for that sort of thing.)

The entire scene being a lie seems pretty clearly ruled out physically (i.e. medically in this case). Someone claiming that a particular portion of that scene is a lie needs to explain both the additional complexity in their model of where the boundaries lie between the truth and the lies, and still has to answer the initial question of why the heck she would bother. One of my favorite bits in Code Geass is when Lelouch gives that speech where he says "People lie because they want something." As a believer in science and rationality I've always considered lying to be a Bad Thing(TM), but in that scene he makes it clear that he's not just talking about con artists; people sometimes lie when they have something of their own that they need to protect. So what exactly does Miho need from Kimiko here, that she needs to take through deception?

It's hard to come up with much of anything to fit that bill if she's genuinely frantic and horrified at what she thinks has happened to Piro; and if she's not, if the whole thing is a lie from start to finish, she knows Piro's fine and doesn't really care anyway, then a model claiming that has to explain why there is no evidence for that position anywhere in the ensuing comics.
Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 7:48 am
She is a liar liar...
But you can't point to a single comic out of fifteen going on sixteen hundred in which she lies.
Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:52 pm
that sounds like a version of Johnie Cochran's "Chewbaca Defense."
It is amusing, in a horrible and disgusting kind of way, that you should make use of such an example. The only reason those antics got any traction, let alone succeeded, was that our justice system's foundational principle of "innocent until proven guilty" overrides even the prejudices and personal antagonisms of those tasked with determining and delivering said justice. That has not, to put it mildly, been your stated attitude toward Miho.
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Teddy-Werebear » Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:32 am

darrin wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:16 pm
But you can't point to a single comic out of fifteen going on sixteen hundred in which she lies.
I would retort, "every time Miho move those desicated lips," but I doubt you would believe anything this bear offers. It is the way of you Miho thralls to never find fault your psychic vampire succubus 223rd layer of the Abyss skinwalking as your goth girl mistress. You have my sympathies, D. I shall try not to antagonize you any further.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by cidjen » Tue Feb 25, 2020 4:58 am

Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 3:52 pm
Cidjen... that sounds like a version of Johnie Cochran's "Chewbaca Defense."
Rhyming slang for "it doesn't make sense"? Perhaps. But it's (to me) better than any alternative (_I_) could come up with.
cidjen wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 8:16 am
So she herself came with ways to try explain it, even to herself. As explained in current page.

It's not a lie per-se, because nobody, even her herself, knows what the truth really was.
I thought I wrote that ;) so I'll repeat.

As Ibara-senior-san helpfully remarked, no one knows what REALLY happened, because (to them) it's not important.

You'd think, it'll be important to Miho, to remember what really happened? Maybe if she wasn't looping it countless times. She's so past that, that the reality and story has blurred and took its own course. And still it didn't help, the Horde is still after her. Even with her friends turned furries and the only amicable soul turned bartender at the club. Now she has no choice but continue making it up.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by darrin » Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:26 pm

Teddy-Werebear wrote:
Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:32 am
I would retort, "every time Miho move those desicated lips,"
"She always lies."
"Well, when? Can you give a specific example?"
"Yep, always. She always lies."

You do at least get that that's non-responsive, right? I'm not asking you to care that it's non-responsive mind you :lol: :lol: :lol: just factually that it is.
but I doubt you would believe anything this bear offers.
You don't have to doubt, and you don't have to wait for me to "believe", and you could easily prove this new claim (that I am lying about being a Bayesian and am actually obtusely recalcitrant) with exactly the same single piece of evidence requested for your non-meta claim: a strip where she's clearly lying. It's a four digit number, thirteen bits less entropy than a frigging telephone number.

You can't have it both ways. Either the evidence is easy to obtain and present; or, if it's subtle, complex, and occult, then the claims for the position requiring that much non-trivial evidence should not be so strident and absolute.
I shall try not to antagonize you any further.
Someone saying they have lots of evidence for 2+2 being five, but that they can't be arsed to show any of it, isn't antagonizing me; I'm just morbidly curious as to what's going on in their head to generate that claim.
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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by Yl33 D4 N00b » Fri Feb 28, 2020 4:07 pm

Actually,(not to give Teddy any more ammo, but still....) Miho did lie to Piro when she told him she was actually a guy during her original hospital stay when she was playing as Moh. Remember, in #1280 she said she used Phil the janitor as a stand-in.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by cidjen » Fri Feb 28, 2020 7:45 pm

Yl33 D4 N00b wrote:
Fri Feb 28, 2020 4:07 pm
Miho did lie to Piro when she told him she was actually a guy
Right, but that was (a pretty harsh, I give you that) way to discourage Piro from trying to go to Tokyo earlier and finding her; from becoming one with the Horde. From being swallowed by the story that gobbled the other people that tried to save her.

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Re: [1568] making it up

Post by darrin » Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:03 pm

Yl33 D4 N00b wrote:
Fri Feb 28, 2020 4:07 pm
Actually,(not to give Teddy any more ammo, but still....) Miho did lie to Piro when she told him she was actually a guy during her original hospital stay when she was playing as Moh. Remember, in #1280 she said she used Phil the janitor as a stand-in.
Well, yeah, I specifically addressed that incident about 16 posts back up above:
darrin wrote:
Wed Feb 19, 2020 8:29 pm
Okay, according to Piro she was lying when she lied that she wasn't a girl. But -1 * -1 = 1 so that doesn't count.
I admit to having phased it pretty clumsily. On reflection shortly after posting I decided that:

"Okay, according to Piro, she was lying when she said that she had been lying that she was a girl."

would have been a less convoluted way of putting it. But I was too lazy to go back and edit at the time, sorry.

Point is, the math still stands. 8-)
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